« VorigeDoorgaan »
making this clear, as MR. MACDONAGH states they do, the official documents can be referred to in the opposite sense.
Mr. Wickham's letter of 28 August, 1803, states, "The only evidence which could at present be produced against him [Emmet] is what follows" (the italics are in the book), but there is not a single word in reference to documentary evidence which could not be produced; and I am not surprised that other official letters contain no reference to the correspondence between Miss Curran and Emmet. It was unnecessary to refer to it, as it was unnecessary to produce it.
The Chief Secretary (Mr. Wickham) writes to Curran :
"The Lord Lieutenant is obliged to direct that a search should be made in your house for papers connected with the late treasonable conspiracy. The Lord Lieutenant is persuaded they have been concealed there without your knowledge, but it is not the less necessary that the search should be made with the utmost exactness. As the circumstances which lead to this investigation particularly affect Miss Sarah Curran, it will be necessary that she should be immediately examined."
Mr. Wickham (9 September, 1803) informed the Home Secretary of Major Sirr's report on Miss Curran's state of mind :
Unfortunately, Mr. Curran was not at home, and still more unfortunately the young lady was not up, though the rest of the family (two other daughters and a son) were assembled at breakfast, so that the major entered the room where she was still in bed. This circumstance occasioned a scene of great confusion and distress, and was also productive of some inconvenience, for whilst the major and the other daughter were giving assistance to Mr. Emmet's correspondent who was thrown into violent convulsions-the eldest Miss Curran continued to destroy some papers, the few scraps of which that were saved are in Mr. Emmet's handwriting.'
In his book MR. MACDONAGH ungrudgingly refers to Major Sirr as "a capable and daring officer." I do not suppose the search was made but with "6 "utmost exactness." Mr. Wickham does not mention with what result. MR. MACDONAGH remarks, however, that Major Sirr's report "states" that Sarah Curran's
"brother and sister succeeded in burning, in the breakfast-room downstairs, whatever compromising documents were in the house, and that therefore no papers fell into his hands."
Presuming the report really states this, and if MR. MACDONAGH can show that it was only in this house and at this visit that correspondence could have been found, then it must be that the report was immediately sent off, before the full search was conducted. (But I should like to see the report, for other reasons already stated.) The Major awaited
the visit of the Attorney-General, and Mr. Wickham's reply, given at 10th S. iii. 303, and preserved with Major Sirr's papers in T.C.D. Library.
As the outcome of the Lord Lieutenant's decision that no action should be taken against Miss Curran, Mr. Wickham added (to the Home Secretary) :
"The Lord Lieutenant particularly requests that Miss Curran's name may not be mentioned. It is difficult that it should be long concealed, but it is desirable that it should not be first mentioned by any member of Government in either country.”
MR. MACDONAGH writes :
"Chief Secretary Wickham, writing to Pole Carew of the Home Office about the trial [of Emmet], says Mr. Yorke will have observed that such parts of the young lady's letter found upon the Attorney-General, when he gave in evidence Emmet as it was found necessary to produce, stated boldly that the letter from which the extracts was made had been written by a brother conspirator. Unfortunately, a barrister of the name of Huband, who is said to have paid his addresses formerly to the young lady, recognized the handwriting when the letter was laid on the table."-P. 398: the italics are in the book.
I do not think it can be made clearer from the official documents given by MR. MACDONAGH why the correspondence between Miss Sarah Curran and Robert Emmet which was in Major Sirr's keeping was not requisitioned or mentioned, and there is the best of evidence in support of Dr. Sirr's testimony as to the great tenderness with which Miss Curran was treated. This young lady unquestionably had much on her mind. Even so, I think she was not particularly strong. We learn of her violent convulsions, and I believe MR. MACDONAGH states that she lost her reason for a while. She died in 1808; The Gentleman's Magazine states in a rapid decline, while it is popularly thought she died of a broken heart. Possibly she altered her views (which no doubt had been influenced by exaggerated presentments in print of the revolutionary doctrines preached in France) when she married an army officer. However this may be, Dr. Sirr merely made a brief note; but he suggested her mind was not strong when she was under Emmet's influence, and I think the fact of her violent convulsions and subsequent loss of reason is not incompatible with his wording.
I judge from their long letters printed in the book that both Miss Curran and Robert Emmet wrote with ease (Emmet was quite proficient in the art of disguising his handwriting), and without doubt they had much time on their hands.
I have received a sympathetic letter with reference to Dr. Sirr and implications about
him in this discussion; but in conclusion my paper, exposing their intentions, &c., under the correspondent writes :signature of Whipcord.-J. D. Sirr."
"In any case J. D. S.'s note stands. I suppose he may have been mistaken in thinking that the Emmet-Curran letters formed the whole of the pile he saw burnt-perhaps they were contained in it along with papers which for some reason were also being burnt. But the substance of his note would remain, and must still be accounted for."
I would merely add that I have not said anything insisting upon the note being received pedantically. What I have been insistent upon is that canons of modern historical criticism should be applied; and it seems to me that the note would stand the tests of historians acknowledged to be impartial; though, unless for the purpose of helping to bear out other evidence as to the leniency of Government, I do not suppose it would be brought forward.
I fear that it may be inferred from FRANCESCA'S remarks that Dr. Sirr's notes are the general expression of his own opinions, as though he claimed to be a judge of Irish history at the time of the rebellion of 1798 and the insurrection of 1803, and of the characters of some individuals concerned.
I give copies of all the notes, and I think it will be admitted they appear to be the out
come of a natural instinct to record facts or circumstances which were impressed on his memory. The 'D.N.B.' shows he did not discover the papers until after his father's I death. Curran must then have been dead a quarter of a century (and many, if not all, of Miss Sarah Curran's immediate relatives probably were dead also). Be that as it may, there was no likelihood of relatives of Miss Curran or of Emmet seeing the note as to the correspondence.
When Dr. Sirr ultimately decided that the papers should go to Trinity College, Dublin, they were delivered over as he had arranged them. Though the authorities of the College at first kept them very guardedly, Sir John Gray and Mr. Madden had access to them.
Note re an anonymous letter to Major Sirr.'Anonymous threatening letter, of which he received many."
Note re a letter from Sir *** to Major Sirr (circa 15 May, 1815).—" Sir ***, Bart., unfortunately was At other not always sober, or always in his senses. periods he was as affecte and confiding towards my father as he was now unreasonable and absurd.J. D. S."
Note re a letter from Lord Dufferin to Major Sirr, 26 Aug., 1821.-"This was a most extraordinary exhibition to put up in Donnybrook Fair. It was at the period of His Majesty's visit there. Removed by Police to Head police office, as calculated to disturb the public tranquillity."
Note re combination against paying tithes.-Major Sirr sent down by Govt., accompanied by one of the clerks (this is the gist of the note, I believel. "A poor man who attended market was waylaid and beat, being mistaken for Cox, who took a contrary road home in the evening after a walk."
Besides, there are the notes to Mr. Wickham's letter_re the correspondence of Miss Curran and Emmet and to a communication re O'Brien. I believe these are all, but am not absolutely positive. H. SIRR.
'THE CLOISTER AND THE HEARTH' (10th S. iv. 249).—The account of the German inn (chap. xxiv. pp. 132 sqq. in Chatto & Windus's "fine-paper edition," 1900) and that of the Burgundian inn in chap. xxxiii. should be closely compared with Erasmus's colloquy Diversoria.' It will be found that Charles Reade was indebted to this in many points.
The shipwreck in chap. lvii. is largely based on Erasmus's 'Naufragium.' There are various isolated touches in Reade's book for which he seems to have dra vn on the Colloquiæ,' e.g. cf. p. 634, chap. lxxxiv., with 'Adolescens et Scortum.'
It is tempting to indicate the novelist's gains from other sources, such as Shakespeare's comedies and 'Coryat's Crudities,' but that would be passing beyond the immediate subject of the query.
Some of the material on which Charles Reade so admirably wrought came from the Colloquies' of Erasmus. ST. SWITHIN.
I believe Dr. Sirr's note about Miss Curran's and Emmet's correspondence never appeared in print until I sent it to 'N. & Q.' Dr. Sirr cannot be held to have carefully defeated his father's humane intentions, as FRANCESCA suggests. Even if he gave a second thought about the notes, he could not have 'DON QUIXOTE,' 1595-6 (10th S. iv. 107, 158). erased them, I believe, without mutilating-Surely the title alone of the volumes is the letters or the album. sufficient to show that they are not of the dates mentioned, as it is in French instead of Spanish. The information given on p. 107 Note re letter of Mr. Secretary Cooke to Major is too meagre for any one to form an opinion. Sirr (undated). "Bravo Brennan once a writer for the republican party, and acquainted with all But, as has often been said before in 'N. & Q.,' their characters. He wrote in the Hib Journal nobody can tell the value of anything withvery cutting replies to articles in the Press News-out seeing and inspecting. I have looked at
Copies of Dr. Sirr's Notes.
Ashbee's 'Iconography,' but do not find these volumes in his lists. RALPH THOMAS.
FLEET STREET, No. 53 (10th S. iii. 427, 493; iv. 94).—The prints of Westminster and London, making a panoramic view which begins with the south end of Westminster and ends with the Tower and London Bridge, engraved by S. & N. Buck, were published "Sept. 11th, 1749, No. 1. Garden Court, Middle Temple, London." These five prints I have before me. As to place or places of publication of the rest of the (about) 500 views engraved by the brothers Buck I know nothing. ROBERT PIERPOINT.
ETON SCHOOL LISTS (10th S. iv. 187).-Is there any note in these lists of George, Earl Waldegrave, who was unfortunately drowned when at Eton in 1794, at the early age of ten years? He had succeeded to the title in 1789, when only five years of age. The probability is that he was buried with his ancestors at Navestock, in Essex, in the mausoleum adjoining the church.
JOHN PICKFORD, M.A. Newbourne Rectory, Woodbridge.
THE PURPOSE OF A FLAW (10th S. iv. 208). -In Lower Bengal, where I lived for many years, the same custom was common as regards the building of a new pucca (brick) house (there were no stones there) and of a Muth (Hindoo temple). Some part was always left in an unfinished state. The reason of this, however, was a superstition among the natives that, if any one completed such a building, he would die shortly afterwards. Might not this Oriental idea have some bearing with regard to the Jewish dwellings? ALEX. THOMS.
RIPLEY ARMS (10th S. iii. 167).-Some months ago I asked for information as to the existence of an heraldic seal of early date bearing the arms of Ripley of Ripley Castle, near Fountains Abbey, Yorkshire, but obtained no response. Can any one now give me information on another point? In Papworth's Ordinary,' under "3 lions," there occurs the following blazon : "Per chev. arg. and az. three lions ramp. counterchanged. SIR...... REPLEY," and the reference (v.) is to Glover's 'Ordinary,' Cotton MS. Tiberius D. 10; Harl. MSS. 1392 and 1459. But in the copy of 'Glover's Roll' printed in 1868 by George J. Armytage I am unable to find any such blazon, or any reference to the name of Ripley or Repley. Is Mr. Armytage's Roll the Ordinary' referred to in Papworth? And if so, how is the omission of this blazon to be accounted for? A. CALDER.
OFFICERS OF STATE IN IRELAND (10th S. iv. 149, 214).-With reference to the answer at the latter reference, I should like to state that I am acquainted with the lists in the Book of Dignities,' and have reason to believe them inaccurate. Could any contributor refer me to the actual records from which information may be derived about the Officers of State in Ireland, in particular the Principal Secretary of State, or Secretary of the Council, and Secretary to the Lord Lieutenant, or Secretary for Ireland? My name is Holt, not 'Hall," as printed ante, p. 149. R. VINCENT HOLT.
Lincoln College, Oxford.
The authoritative lists of such officers wil be found in the 'Liber Munerum Publicorum Hiberniæ; or, the Establishments of Ireland from the 19th of King Stephen to the 7th of George IV.,' compiled by Rowley Lascelles, of the Middle Temple, barrister-at-law, under the authority of Parliament, and ordered to be printed in 1824. An index to the work will be found in Appendix III. of the Ninth Report of the Deputy Keeper of the Records in Ireland (1877). EDMUND T. BEWLEY.
MANAGER (10th S. iv. 204).-Is MR. LAWRENCE JOHN BLAND, THE EDINBURGH ACTOR acquainted with what has already appeared in N. & Q.' respecting this celebrated actor! See 9th S. xii. 207, 277, 335.
ÉVERARD HOME COLEMAN.
71, Brecknock Road.
ISAAC JOHNSON, OF MASSACHUSETTS (10 iv. 227).-Had he any children? His wife, Lady Arbella Clinton, alias ffynes, was & descendant of George, Duke of Clarence See the Plantagenet Roll,' Clarence vol, p. 174. Any information would greatly RUVIGNY.
Galway Cottage, Chertsey.
THE ALMSMEN, WESTMINSTER ABBEY (10 S. iv. 168, 236).-May I be permitted to say that, if MR. HARLAND-OXLEY be right as to the constitution of this body of men-and it would appear from his statement that he must be there seems to be something wrong somewhere? I have been informed that Mr. Smith, lately connected with the church of St. James the Less, Westminster, and previously in the employment of Messrs. Mowlen & Co., has been, upon the suggestion of the Rev. Theophilus Greatorex, the vicar of that church, nominated to be one of the almsmen by the Dean of Westminster; and a further statement was made to me that the aforesaid Mr. Smith has never been in either the navy or army. It may not be out of place to
ask if the old constitution of Queen Elizabeth has been changed; and, if so, when it was done, and by what authority. EDWARD TANSLEY.
Warwick Street, South Belgravia, S.W.
COMBERMERE ABBEY (10th S. iv. 229).Possibly MR. BERESFORD may like to be referred to 'The Book of the Abbot of Combermere, 1289-1529,' containing abstracts of Nantwich deeds, leases, and rentals between those dates relating to lands, dwellings, salt houses, and pikes in Nantwich belonging to the abbot and convent of Combermere, published by Mr. James Hall, of Nantwich, for the Record Society of Lancashire and Cheshire.
I do not know where the chartulary of Combermere Abbey is, but probably Viscount he Combermere, who lives at Chaseley House, Rugeley, might be able to throw some light on the subject.
T. CANN HUGHES, M.A., F.S.A.
ALMANSA (10th S. iv. 248).-The full name is Andres de Almansa y Mendoza. Several of his letters, in Spanish, will be found in the British Museum Library. An English translation of one of them, called 'A Relation of the Departure of the Prince of Wales from Madrid, 1623,' is given in Lord Somers's 'Collection of Scarce and Valuable Tracts,' edited by Sir Walter Scott, 1809, vol. ii. p. 540, but the author's name is abbreviated to Andrez de Mendoza.”
JAS. PLATT, Jun.
"Our countryman" mentioned in the quotation is evidently Prince Charles, not Andrea de Almansa y Mendoza, author of Novedades de esta Corte y Avisos recibidos de otras Partes, 1621-26.' An edition of this book was published at Madrid in 1886.
ROBERT B. DOUGLAS.
64, Rue des Martyrs, Paris.
DUMMER FAMILY (10th S. iv. 230).-There are depositions on record in regard to the rectory of Hardwick, Bucks, showing that John Dummer was rector there in 1689. An abstract of title in my possession relative to the manors of Cossington and Rooksbridge, in East and West Pennard, Somersetshire, recites indentures dated 1 June, 1792, to which Nathaniel Dance, Esq., and Harriet his wife, late Harriet Dummer, widow and executrix of Thomas Dummer, Esq., were parties.
The late Prof. Edward Elbridge Salisbury, of New Haven, Connecticut, printed an account of the Pyldren - Dummer family in
W. R. BEXFIELD (10th S. iv. 267).—Died in London, 28 October, 1853; organist of St. Helen's, Bishopsgate. W. H. CUMMINGS.
Dr. William Richard Bexfield died 29 October, 1853, and was buried in St. Mary's, Paddington, 31 October. Grove's Dictionary gives 28 October as the date of death. In the register of death it is, however, given as above. The date of burial is taken from the sexton's book. Bexfield died at 12, Monmouth Road South.
J. S. S.
[Several other correspondents are thanked for replies.]
GIBBETS (10th S. iv. 229, 251, 296).-When in the town of Grand Andely, Normandy, this summer, I noticed several gibbet-like structures standing in various places near the roadside. On inquiring their purpose I
was told that they were for hanging lights to on dark winter nights. In every case bricks or pieces of wood were suspended to keep the ropes in place over the pulleys. I venture to throw out the suggestion that it was an old-time lamp-post of this kind that General Booth saw. It will be noticed that on a hill a few yards from the road" is a likely enough position for a light. Carving the piece of wood used to keep the rope in place into the form of a man's head would easily suggest itself. W. R. B. PRIDEAUX.
The gibbet which General Booth saw stands on the roadside between Elsdon and Cambo, at a place called Sting Cross, a wild and lonely spot in the northern uplands of Northumberland. The present gibbet is not old, but was erected by Sir Charles Trevelyan (father of the biographer of Macaulay) on the spot where stood "Winter's Stob." This was the gibbet on which hung the body of William Winter, who was executed for murder at Newcastle on 10 August, 1792. The details of the story will be found in The Monthly Chronicle of North-Country Lore and Legend, vol. i. pp. 106, 186. Winter had murdered an old woman, and after being hanged at Newcastle his body was suspended on the gibbet until through decomposition every vestige of it disappeared. Its place was supplied by a wooden effigy, of which eventually only the head remained. The gibbet itself fell to decay, and, as I have remarked above, the present erection is modern. Even now it is an uncanny enough sight; but what must it have been to the solitary traveller a century ago, when the decaying body and the creaking chains came suddenly within view just when darkness was coming on?
I have a photograph of Winter's Stob, and also one of the Caxton gibbet, which I believe is still standing in Cambridgeshire. Both are at the disposal of your correspondent. W. E. WILSON.
On 1 August, 1832, Wm. Jobling was tried at Durham Assizes for the murder of Nicholas Fairless, a magistrate, and sentenced to be hanged and his body hung in chains near the scene of the murder, which took place on a road leading from South Shields to Jarrow, round Jarrow Slake, a large expanse of mud flats, dry at low tide, stretching from the Tyne. A portion of these mud flats was taken to make the Tyne Dock of the North-Eastern Railway Company-the most important dock on the Tyne. The gibbet was set up on the
slake at a little distance from the road, and the "stob" remained until the dock was made, somewhere about the middle of the last century. The cage in which the body was encased, made of hoop-iron, is now in the collection of the Society of Antiquaries of Newcastle, in their museum at the Blackgate in that city. For an account of the trial and gibbeting see Sykes's 'Local Records,' vol. i p. 388. R. B-R
The date in my reply should have been 1847, not 1849. A. N.
AUTHOR OF QUOTATION WANTED (10th S iv. 249).-The lines "She never found fault with you" are from Mrs. E. B. Browning's poem 'My Kate.'
DUCHESS OF CANNIZARO (10th S. iv. 265)The Duke of Cannizaro lived in the mansio on the west side of Wimbledon Common which had been occupied previously Henry Dundas, first Viscount Melville. was afterwards called Cannizaro House. Mr. Bartlett, in his History of Wimbledon p. 164, writes: "The Duke of Cannizan originally Count St. Antonio, was a refuge who married a rich English heiress, and became immortalized in one of the 'Ingoldsby Legends." W. P. COURTNEY.
If E. M. will make a search among the marriages given in 'The Annual Register' The Gentleman's Magazine, in or before 183 he will perhaps get the name of the lady i question. EDWARD SMITH
"TINTERERO" (10th S. iv. 267).-Judging by its form, I think this is a Spanish word though I cannot find it in any Spanish die tionary. It appears to be derived from tinta, ink, and may be a popular name for those huge cuttle-fish which emit a black fluid like ink when in danger of being taken Compare the term "ink-fish" applied to the by English sailors.
JAS. PLATT, Jan.
I would suggest that there is no such word in French, or in any other of the continental languages, and that it is simply a misprin for the Spanish word tintorera.
The dictionary of the Spanish Academy gives tintorera as the female of tiburon, which it describes as a marine fish, a species of deg or wolf, but of monstrous size, reaching t 20 ft. in length, and of corresponding bu It gives some further particulars, and add it is most voracious of human flesh.
In Velazquez's 'Spanish Dictionary' tibur is given as the equivalent of shark; and the Imperial English Dictionary' tiburo